Cleveland Sports Forum

eocmcdoc wrote:Mansfield Distributing (BUD stuff), had a big kick off at Clear Fork Skit Resort this past Thursday. Their trucks are hitting the road at 5am. My little pizza shop will get it Thursday.

Speaking of which, I just watched the first episode of the Ken Burns Prohibition series.




Not that I'm proud of this, but my wife and kids fully expect me to salute every time I drive past a Budweiser product truck or the area brewery. I did it a once early on and they seemed to like it.


My favorite personal nuance that they liked was when I passed a Home Depot (now "Office Depot") truck and said, "I wanna put Tony Stewart in the wall!."



McDoc, seriously make certain you and your staff are diligent about checking ID's.

The law is not so permissive these days as it was when I was 16 and knew every store that would sell 3.2% "Sunday Beer" to me. Our little town regularly has "sting operations" to nail stores and restaurants who have usually mistakenly sold alcohol to anyone under 21.

I love pizza and beer!

Cali:

I really enjoyed the first episode of Prohibition. It was exactly what I was hoping he would do. Many of the debates back in the day are the exact ones we have today. What is the role of government? When should it infringe on a personal liberty? When does it go too far?

The Supreme Court should be hearing the Health Care debate soon, and it's mandate on buying insurance.

The more things change the more they stay the same.

You never said anything the other day so once again I will recommend to you Boardwalk Empire. If you don't get HBO I'm sure the first season would be on DVD by now. It's not totally factual like Ken Burns doc, but is loosely based on actual characters of the time, and is a fun look back at that time in our country too.

JC:

Haven't seen you in a while but in case you're still around ...

http://www.cleveland.com/remembers/inde ... de_mo.html
Joe Bertman first made mustard for League Park in the 1920s.

Which mustard tickles your palate? a Cleveland Remembers poll

Published: Monday, October 03, 2011, 9:30 AM

By Special to The Plain Dealer

I started attending Browns games with my father in the late '70s, when I discovered I could leave Sunday school 30 minutes early if going to the game.

Our seats were incredible -- 45ish yard line, upper level but not too high. It was pretty much wasted on me ... I lived for the halftime shows (whatever happened to those?). And the hot dog with stadium mustard. My poor dad had to talk to the others around him about the game as I had little interest.

Imagine my surprise when I went away to school (OSU) and the stadium had only yellow mustard! I thought all stadiums had the good stuff.

After moving away from Cleveland (and Ohio) for a time, being a Browns fan with other former Clevelanders was a great way to bond. By then, I did pay attention to the game. So thanks, Dad, for the memories.

-- Susan Kaminski, Lakewood

Read more about the mustard wars

• Two mustards compete for attention (Plain Dealer, 2002)

http://blog.cleveland.com/pdextra/2009/ ... the_d.html

• The battle of the mustards continues (Plain Dealer, 2009)

http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2009/08 ... rds_c.html

• Bertman Ball Park Mustard website

http://www.bertmanballparkmustard.com/index.htm

• Stadium Mustard website

http://www.stadiummustard.com/

If you liked this story, you might like ...

• Which sandwich tastes like Northeast Ohio to you? Take our poll
• The Frosty Bar at the bottom of Higbee's escalator

If you've got your own memory to share -- of the Browns, of mustard, of good times with your dad or mom -- use our online submission form to tell us about it. We'd love to hear from you!


Which side of the mustard split are you on?

Stadium Mustard

Bertman Ball Park Mustard

Vote

View Results

Thank you for voting!

Stadium Mustard 51.49% (104 votes)

Bertman Ball Park Mustard 48.51% (98 votes)

Total Votes: 202

Battle of the mustards: Stadium vs. Bertman's

Published: Sunday, August 16, 2009, 8:37 PM Updated: Sunday, October 02, 2011, 10:08 PM

By Plain Dealer staff

The owner of my favorite deli, less than a mile from Jacobs Field, has never heard of Bertman's Original Ballpark Mustard, the only mustard served at the Jake. She uses Authentic Stadium Mustard, the only mustard served at Browns Stadium.

The makers of both mustards, who are based in Cleveland, wish things were otherwise.

"We're in ongoing negotiations with Jacobs Field," says David Dwoskin, owner of Davis Food Company, which makes Stadium Mustard.

"The only reason I'm not in the stadium is that I wouldn't pay $10,000 [for a program ad]," declares Pat Mazoh, owner of Joe Bertman Foods, which makes Bertman's Original Ballpark Mustard.

Twenty-five years ago, the city had just one local brown mustard -- the late Joe Bertman's, which he developed, according to daughter Mazoh. Coincidentally, Dwoskin represented the brand, successfully peddling it to retailers throughout Ohio. In 1970, Dwoskin registered the name: Authentic Stadium Mustard. For complicated reasons, the two men fell out in the early '80s, and a single brown mustard became two.

Dwoskin continues to sell Authentic Stadium, which is manufactured in Illinois. Mazoh calls her mustard, made in southern Ohio, Bertman's Original Ballpark Mustard.

Both mustards apparently enjoy wide distribution. Dwoskin contends his mustard is served in 150 stadiums in the United States. Mazoh mentions Ohio Turnpike plazas and hot dog restaurants in a couple of states. Locally, the mustards are sold in grocery stores and specialty food shops.

Each owner lays dibs to the original mustard formula. It's hard to tell them apart, though. A recent blind tasting revealed remarkable similarities. Both mustards look the same and are smooth and mild-tasting. Both lift hot dogs to new heights.

Only Dwoskin and Mazoh don't see it that way.

"It's a different mustard entirely," sniffs Dwoskin. "We don't have any sugar in our product."

"It's not enough to bother diabetics, dietitians tell me," insists Mazoh. "I think he's watering down [his] product a bit."

Neither side admits to waging mustard war. "It's long since gone," says Mazoh, just before advising me to call a store owner who replaced Authentic Stadium Mustard with hers.

This story was originally published in The Plain Dealer on Sunday, June 23, 2002.

Battle of two spicy mustards continues to rage: Whatever happened too ... ?

Published: Sunday, August 16, 2009, 4:00 AM Updated: Monday, August 17, 2009, 8:34 AM

By Mary Ann Whitley, The Plain Dealer

"Whatever happened to . . .?" is a weekly series updating some of the most newsworthy and interesting stories covered in The Plain Dealer. Have a suggestion on a story we should update? Send it to John C. Kuehner or call 216-999-5325.

Whatever happened to the feud between Stadium Mustard and Ball Park Mustard, both Cleveland-made condiments?

It simmers on, with occasional skirmishes and amid continuing confusion.


Skirmishes? The operator of concession stands at Cleveland Hopkins International Airport said Bertman Original Ball Park Mustard was "my No. 1-selling souvenir item" until the Transportation Security Administration banned liquids and gels in carry-on luggage three years ago. Now passengers can buy products like mustard after going through security, but a new concessionaire sells only Authentic Stadium Mustard.

Confusion? A national magazine said last year that an Indians game at Progressive Field was a must-visit for summer, especially accompanied by "a hot dog slathered with Cleveland's authentic Ballpark Mustard -- it's the best mustard you'll ever taste." Trouble is, the word "authentic" instead of "original" led a newspaper writer to misquote the recommendation as Stadium Mustard. (Also, the product is "Ball Park" -- two words.)

One person close to the situation said, "The feud will go on as long as they're alive" -- referring to Pat Bertman Mazoh, daughter of Ball Park Mustard originator Joseph Bertman, and David Dwoskin, president of Davis Food Co., which supplies Stadium Mustard.

The short version of the story is that Joe Bertman started a wholesale grocery business in the 1920s and was selling his spicy brown mustard to League Park and Municipal Stadium by the 1930s. Details are in dispute, but Dwoskin entered the business around 1970, with the idea of putting the condiment in stores, and registered the name Authentic Stadium Mustard. Bertman and Dwoskin had a falling out. Two brands emerged. Both were sold at the Stadium in the 1980s.

Now, if you're keeping score of nearby venues, Bertman Ball Park is served at Progressive Field and at Classic Park in Eastlake, home of the Lake County Captains.

Stadium Mustard is served at Cleveland Browns Stadium and at Canal Park, home of the Akron Aeros, which also offers yellow mustard. All-Pro Freight stadium in Avon, home of the independent Frontier League Lake Erie Crushers, serves Stadium Mustard and Heinz yellow mustard.

Finally, neither product is "made in Cleveland." Bertman's is made in southern Ohio and sold mainly in the area. Stadium is made in Illinois and sold "all over the country."

-- Tom Feran

Cali you've reminded me of one of my eighth-grade shop teachers. Some classmate wore a Budweiser t-shirt to school (this was kind of daring) and it caused the "metal shop" teacher to wax sentimental.

"Ah yes. In my youth I decided it was my duty to keep the Anheuser-Busch company in business. To do this, I would need to consume a lot of their product ... "

VT'er wrote:Cali you've reminded me of one of my eighth-grade shop teachers. Some classmate wore a Budweiser t-shirt to school (this was kind of daring) and it caused the "metal shop" teacher to wax sentimental.

"Ah yes. In my youth I decided it was my duty to keep the Anheuser-Busch company in business. To do this, I would need to consume a lot of their product ... "

Oh yes, I've often considered myself a great boost to Anheuser-Busch profits. My wife laments she should have bought stock in them right after she met me. From MIchelob (I was a sucker for "nights are made for Michelob"), to Bud (always loved Ed McMahon showing how to pour a beer, and of course have always loved The Clydesdales) and to even Busch ("head for the mountains")

One of my friends in college had a professor who commented to his class, "I used to have the body of a Greek God......and now I have the body of a go* da*ned Greek (fraternity rat)."

I was normally a pretty "dapper dresser" (by my thought) in high school and college. I really wore a sport coat to class in college on some days, prompting friends years later to ask "did they model Alex P. Keaton (Family Ties) after you?"

I did have a "Busch Beer" t-shirt I wore to high school on rare warm Northern Ohio Friday school days. I had it on in American History class one day and a hot Italian girl sitting in the seat behind me told me that she loved looking at my biceps and the Busch shirt really made them look great. I had no idea she had even noticed me or knew who I was until she made that comment.

I met her at a party the next weekend and after providing her with four beers, we found an unused room. I can't remember at all which of our friends lived at the house (with their parents away).

I kept that shirt for a long time.....

Hillbilly,

I just remember really liking the mustard at Indians Games in the 1970's. I'm not sure which one they used then.

Today out here I really like mustards from Rocky Coltrane's Oregon.



Beaver Mustard

http://beavertonfoods.com/beaver.php

(Though Rocky Coltrane is an Oregon Duck Fan, and likely wouldn't buy the product because of it's name.

I normally stock a few different mustards as my tastes vary dependent upon the food. If I'm having a simple lunch meat sandwich with mayo and mustard on white bread I usually go with the standard French's.

If I'm having a sausage dog with sweet grilled onions and peppers, I usually go the spicier route.

For a Hebrew National hot dog I usually am pretty flexible as I also add ketchup and sweet relish.

Hillbilly, I have the 2nd episode of the Ken Burns Prohibition on in progress.

I've liked it as well, of course. It's very nicely done, but not as captivating for me as most of his other works.


Whether it was Baseball, Jazz, Horatio's Drive, National Parks or even The Civil War there was always an angle for Burns to weave romantic thought, appreciation of the past, and nostalgia into the story. It may seem odd to include The Civil War in that sentence, but he did a marvelous job of personalizing the life stories of the typical soldiers and their families.

Prohibition really doesn't give him that angle, but thus far it's a great job of capturing the entire story and relating it in a historically accurate way. Again, very personalized stories and certainly worth watching a 2nd time so I will likely add it to my DVD library down the road.

I'll try to check out Boardwalk Empire. I quit paying for HBO when I noted there was rarely a movie aired in the last several years that I cared to watch. Comcast gives us more than enough movie choices for my needs on On Demand Encore and Movieplex. They are included in the one step up I pay for to get Turner Classic Movies.

Cali:

I have cancelled HBO a couple different times in recent years. I got ticked that they support that vulger, vile, hateful, commie piece of $#!^, Bill Maher, and cancelled them. Then I cancelled again after the episode of Curb your Enthusiasm when Larry David pee'd on a picture of Jesus.

But I had to order it up again to watch this second season of Boardwalk Empire.

My hypocrisy knows no bounds.

I used to just order HBO long enough to watch an episode of Sopranos or Boardwalk Empire. But DirecTV has caught on to that game so now they have started charging people a $10 fee for early cancellation if you order a premium channel and cancel it within one month.

I know I mentioned this once before but since the Amanda Knox story has once again hit the news I will mention it again. ... I would highly recommend the book Monster Of Florence to anyone. It's a true story about a serial killer in Florence, Italy.

The same people that fumbled that case is the same people that tried to railroad this American girl.

If you read that book it gives this whole Amanda Knox story a totally different feel.

I for one am glad she is free. At worst she may have knew something she didn't tell, but I don't believe she had any hand in the murder. And after reading that book I have no doubt the bumbling fools tried to railroad her as they have people (Americans) in the past, with bizarre stories of occultism and crap.

Then I cancelled again after the episode of Curb your Enthusiasm when Larry David pee'd on a picture of Jesus.

Got to at least comment on this. The pee actually splashed out of the toilet and on to a picture of Jesus that was hung on a wall that was shoulder height. When David attempts to wipe it clean the owner says that Jesus is actually crying and starts a national uproar.

Not a real fan of David's whiny humor but that was one of the funniest tv shows that I have ever seen.

In context I did not find it offensive.

Anyone that has HBO can download HBO GO for your computer. Greatest thing since sliced bread. You can watch every episode of all the HBO series, movies, specials and anything HBO has aired. You no longer have to record anything or buy DVDs.

Amanda Knox is free and Casey Anthony is free.

Cute young white chicks get off....


(Actually I do not have a strong opinion or detailed background on either case and just am glad both are free if they really were innocent)

Seagull:

Thanks for the heads up. I am not familiar with that HBO feature but it does sound very cool.

Cali:

I actually have a totally different feeling about Casey Anthony. And I think Knox knew more then she let on. But she spent 4 years in prison for whatever lie she told to police covering for her boyfriend or whatever so I think it has been a wash.